| Author | Message |
Jim Ryan 
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
|  3/3/2008 8:51:24 AM 
I wonder how many installers that can explain in detail, exactly how to stretch, when considering one room, adjacent to another room.
I don't see where any of the teaching orgs, teach how, do any of you?
Can the unions teach us?
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/3/2008 9:04:33 AM
I wonder, did Roberts ever detail the installation method in words and if so, why don't installers know of the absolute best method of installing?
Can even the teaching orgs answer such or don't they want the best?
Will they say Roberts is not the best?
If they make that claim, can they prove such, by detailing the method in words and then explain the weaknesses?
I've never seen any board even speak of the different methods, considering even one room to another. They simply have a diagram of installing one room.
Does one room teach installers how to do an entire job? Perhaps someone should read Roberts manual, if they can find one and understand it.
It doesn't seem any of the installers understand such, so how can this industry claim to teach?
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/3/2008 9:21:26 AM
I ask, IS the Roberts method of installing the best and if so, why doesn't the industry teach such?
Is there another method?
When teaching the stretch of one room, how does that teach the installers about the entire stretch--concerning adjacent rooms?
Why not write a magazine article about such and see what returns?
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/3/2008 1:53:25 PM
I know that for most all, it has been taught that the almighty dollar is the end all, but there are some people left in the world that believe that money is just part of the side effects of doing the best, so that entails knowing the best and proving it.
So, is there anyone in the industry willing to do some research and tell the installers what they need to understand?
I know it had to exist at one time.
The CRI doesn't even post the proper method for installation and CFI refuses to correct it.
What does that say about our industry?
It has always been and will always be,--about the leadership in any endeavor.
In news circles, when something like this is realized, someone in the news usually writes about it and informs their readership, so will any news outlets in this industry write about such?
Does the American leadership in this nation teach all the other nations or do they do things differently?
I'd sure like to know what the Germans and the Russians and other nations think, when it comes to installing.
Don't any of you or do ya'll believe we are the best and if you believe we are the best, can any of you prove it? I'd love a shot at such a real world title--while I still can.
WOULDN'T YOU???
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/3/2008 2:02:22 PM
If any of you would be afraid of a shot at a world title, then you are not near confident enough to teach.
Since there has never been such universal contests for working men to showcase their knowledge and expertise, it's probably a safe bet ya'll can keep teaching--whatever. 
It might be a good idea for nations at odds, to use such competitions on the working level, so that other countries men and women can showcase their skills and knowledge.
That way, all other countries would have the same chances at being the best, while learning new things for each others industries.
If all countries can walk away with new thinking and actions, then the chances for fighting are lessened by quite a bit, because if certain countries are not allowed into the games, their workers and their corporations will not progress anywhere near as fast or as well.
Last Edited 3/3/2008
3:15:11 PM
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Roland Thompson
Posts: 281
Since: 2/27/2008
| 3/3/2008 8:02:13 PM
I heard that back in 2006 Japan send thier best of carpet and vinyl over and they held an installtion contest at the WFCA head quarter's in Cal. then they worked with each other to see each one's method's
FD
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/3/2008 8:32:18 PM
quote:
I heard that back in 2006 Japan send thier best of carpet and vinyl over and they held an installtion contest at the WFCA head quarter's in Cal. then they worked with each other to see each one's method's
FD
Cool, but competition and the worlds top participants from each country, would be just as good as it gets.
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/4/2008 8:21:38 AM
It seems that every time I bring something like this forth, this industry proves it couldn't care less. What does that tell all installers?
Is pride worth so much?
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Ray Darrah
Posts: 1411
Since: 2/18/2008
| 3/4/2008 12:01:42 PM
to heck with it..
everything should be glued down.
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/7/2008 4:25:17 PM
Someone could easily turn these 2 things into a teaching seminar, with the right backing.
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/7/2008 7:46:38 PM
Ok, can anyone think of reasons to use more glue, while at other times, there are reasons for using less glue?
OR, are you a one size fits all--for each product? You know, one size for vinyl, one for carpet, one for wood and one for tile?
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/7/2008 8:29:41 PM
Ya see, if I were an industry leader and some guy like myself was saying all this stuff, I'd be challenging him on every detail and if I wasn't disproving what he said, I'd be incorporating it into what was being taught in the industry.
If CRI THE UNIONS OR OTHERS KNOW OR KNEW THE ROBERTS METHOD AND NONE OF THE INSTALLERS KNEW OF IT, especially since it is the ONLY installation method, perhaps it would be wise to find out, don't you think?
If they don't find out and they don't ask, then that can only mean one thing, they don't care if installers know the only method.
CRI refuses to change their installation diagram, because I am the one that pointed out how it was wrong. My work is used in other places as well.
If leaders are so proud, so are their children.
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Ray Darrah
Posts: 1411
Since: 2/18/2008
| 3/7/2008 10:33:43 PM
quote:
Ya see, if I were an industry leader and some guy like myself was saying all this stuff, I'd be challenging him on every detail and if I wasn't disproving what he said, I'd be incorporating it into what was being taught in the industry.
If CRI THE UNIONS OR OTHERS KNOW OR KNEW THE ROBERTS METHOD AND NONE OF THE INSTALLERS KNEW OF IT, especially since it is the ONLY installation method, perhaps it would be wise to find out, don't you think?
If they don't find out and they don't ask, then that can only mean one thing, they don't care if installers know the only method.
CRI refuses to change their installation diagram, because I am the one that pointed out how it was wrong. My work is used in other places as well.
If leaders are so proud, so are their children.
you will love the CFI... they don't agree with the CRI-105 or 104 either and state the diagram is wrong. Jim has been teaching that since I met him in the late 1980's...
You and Jim will clash because you are too much the same
x
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/7/2008 11:12:29 PM
quote:
you will love the CFI... they don't agree with the CRI-105 or 104 either and state the diagram is wrong. Jim has been teaching that since I met him in the late 1980's...
You and Jim will clash because you are too much the same
x
None of the CFI guys ever claimed once that diagram was wrong and I never heard Jim Walker say it, but ok, let's say he did, why is it that the mills that have supported him and the CFI, not stepped-in and made this right for the entire industry?
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Ray Darrah
Posts: 1411
Since: 2/18/2008
| 3/8/2008 6:45:22 AM
Jim,
The Carpet and Rug Institute publishes the Standards, but mills, installers and a group of individuals write the standards.
To answer your question;;; Call the CRI..
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/8/2008 7:01:18 AM
How much glue should be used on the concrete to pad, when doing a double stick and then how much glue should be used when sticking the carpet to the pad?
How much glue should be used for carpet glued down in a bar and why? How about a resturant? How about a patio?
What kind of glue should be used for these things?
If you're a top of the line installer, what makes you so?
The mills and the teaching orgs say they want all the installers under one roof, but that's not going to happen.
These men work far too hard for whatever time their bodies will allow, picking up pianos, hutches, standing closets, heavy rolls of carpet, the up and down and stress placed all over the body, all day, almost every day, for ya'll to get such cheap workers and gather them all under one roof or standard.
It ain't gonna happen.
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David Kern
Posts: 518
Since: 2/20/2008
| 3/27/2008 6:12:01 PM
We never got the answer from you, Jim. How much glue?
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Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 3/27/2008 6:18:32 PM
quote:
We never got the answer from you, Jim. How much glue?
David, I will ask that you do as Ray suggests, because it seems they set the standards--even though they have taken much from others and given them no credit.
Once you get their answer, I'll give my reasoning.
Maybe they don't have an answer, but well, Ray said we should ask them, so why don't you or Ray ask them and tell us?
That would be a nice thing to do, don'tcha think?
I wouldn't ask them, because I disagree with some things they say and do, but hey, that's me.
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