|
|
|
| | | Author | Message | Jim Ryan 
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
|  2/26/2008 10:51:45 AM 
I know the word tear looks like your eyes watering, but it's not. It is for tearing something apart.
Anyway, Kickers back in the early 70's to about very early 80's, almost never tore the carpet, unless it was a very lightweight carpet and most likely, kicked incorrectly.
Todays carpets --for the most part have too many fillers and the wrong glues in some cases.
However, the kicker will teach the installers so much information, if they know what to look for and feel. In some cases, the installer shouldn't turn the teeth out, but rather just use the nap teeth alone. Be careful, that can also lead to problems, like ripping the twists apart and making that a face tear in the carpet. One could say it looks like cat hairs in just that area.
There are other ways to tear the carpet, such as cutting the pad incorrectly. --Betcha didn't know that one and, if the installers cut the pad incorrectly, that can lead to a faulty stretch.
The kicker can tell you all sorts of things if you knew what it once was and felt like, verses what it feels like today and yes, most FHA grade--also called builders grade can be kicked, but the installers need to know, by what they see, feel and hear, as to wheather or not they can use a kicker or wheather they need to use a powerstretcher. We all know many installers still use kickers, so if they are at least taught that carpets that can be kicked are rare--except for quite a few buildres grade carpets, it could help them to come around with time.
Ask many older people that they saw their old carpets being stretched-in with a kicker and how long it lasted. Rarely were there any restretches back then, because most all carpet--beside woven felt like a dish-rag and it stretched beautifully.
Today, only wovens still stretch beautifully, but only in one direction, the length, because of the construction and material used.
This following part must be considered very carefully. with carpets today and kicking it in, you can tear the carpets even in the builders grades. Sometimes the mills put more fillers or a different glue in them, that makes the glues dry hard or the fillers are too much.
If you pay attention also to the warp and weft--backing lines and you see larger weft lines, how do you installers think of that and how do you deal with that?
See what I mean, your kicker will teach you, if you knew what carpet felt like before fillers and what it feels like now---OR, YOU HAVE SOMEONE TEACH YOU IN PERSON--USING AT LEAST 8 DIFFERENT CARPETS. In person, there are ways to help them know what they are feeling, that words cannot express, I promise.
|  |
| Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 2/26/2008 12:45:41 PM
Learning what the kicker has to teach, along with fillers and differing warp and weft lines, teaches each man how to use the powerstretcher, much better.
| |
| Darian Brown
Posts: 712
Since: 2/5/2008
| 2/26/2008 12:52:54 PM
Kicker tears, can be caused from overusing tools that are not meant for that job. Yes carpet made differently from your day. So do we install them the same way no. There our more filler for good reason like safety and so on. Now that we have fillers in the carpet. Do you think jarring repeatedly is the right thing to do or power stretch with a smooth motions to the right tightness. You can Learn how to fill your stretcher. If practices.
| |
| Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 2/26/2008 1:01:38 PM
quote:
Kicker tears, can be caused from overusing tools that are not meant for that job. Yes carpet made differently from your day. So do we install them the same way no. There our more filler for good reason like safety and so on. Now that we have fillers in the carpet. Do you think jarring repeatedly is the right thing to do or power stretch with a smooth motions to the right tightness. You can Learn how to fill your stretcher. If practices.
I would disagree and can prove such in person, but hey, that's ok, we can disagree.
I will tell you now that fillers are not needed and are not for safety. Whoever told you that is wrong, but again, each man believes what they think is best.
| |
| Darian Brown
Posts: 712
Since: 2/5/2008
| 2/26/2008 1:30:58 PM
Its ok to disagree as long as we work out a way to agree. May be its a cost thing carpet is expensive.
| |
| Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 2/26/2008 2:55:13 PM
quote:
Its ok to disagree as long as we work out a way to agree. May be its a cost thing carpet is expensive.
From my perspective, it costs them more time and money to produce these carpets laden with fillers, but they expect for it to pay-off in the long run, as the material breaks down and wrinkles a lot faster.
Back in 1971, if we installed a carpet, you can be sure it lasted in many cases, 30 years. I don't think the industry wants carpet to last that long and of course it's up to them, but there are many side effects that I disagree with, created by such.
If men and women teach their children to be just half-way challenged, they and their children will just keep losing ground. It sure seems like blacks and minorities are a lot more concious of that.
It seems they don't mind asking questions and not knowing all the answers, but they know that once they get that education at its highest level, they can teach their children to be better than they were and likely, better than all others all around them.
I wasn't a minority or black and yet, I was made to feel all they did and even more. I started-out with red hair and freckles, so I was not a minority, but most whites treated me as such.
That and my mothers teachings brought me to where I am today.
| |
| Ray Darrah
Posts: 1411
Since: 2/18/2008
| | Darian Brown
Posts: 712
Since: 2/5/2008
| 2/26/2008 3:53:16 PM
Does that mean latex bond is not strong enough when bonded to plastic?
| |
| Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| | Ray Darrah
Posts: 1411
Since: 2/18/2008
| 2/26/2008 8:54:35 PM
quote:
Does that mean latex bond is not strong enough when bonded to plastic?
I don't know the exact answer to your question, but the secondary backings are pre-coated with latex/filler. The latex bonds to that coating and is pushed up into the primary backing and bundle wrap, but not through the backing.
It would be fun, and beneficial, to have a manufacturer explain these things to us.
What i do remember is back in the mid-1980's, or early 1980's when the switch to poly was forced upon us due to shortages of jute.
Two things:: lots of delam and buckling/dimensional stability problems for a few years...
x
| |
| Jim Ryan
Posts: 958
Since: 1/12/2008
| 2/26/2008 9:07:32 PM
quote:
I don't know the exact answer to your question, but the secondary backings are pre-coated with latex/filler. The latex bonds to that coating and is pushed up into the primary backing and bundle wrap, but not through the backing.
It would be fun, and beneficial, to have a manufacturer explain these things to us.
What i do remember is back in the mid-1980's, or early 1980's when the switch to poly was forced upon us due to shortages of jute.
Two things:: lots of delam and buckling/dimensional stability problems for a few years...
x
Ray, why would sbr hold to marble dust and then the sbr hold to the plastic and not sbr to plastic alone, that makes no sense at all, unless you can show how. Why don't the mills clear up that question?
I'd say you have the ear of some mills as an inspector and that you should ask, but I know that you would just hurt yourself for asking, because common sense says, if the sbr will attach itself to the marble dust and then to the plastic, why won't the sbr hold to the plastic without the marble dust? It makes no sense Ray.
I know, I mayu not be considered smart, but I do know the floor and I do understand common sense.
Why didn't you finish telling is about where I was going with this Ray, here's your chance to show us.
| |
|
| | |
Transmitted: 5/12/2026
1:30:04 PM
Powered by FloorBiz Forums
|
|
