12/24/2008
4:44:18 PM 

I was talking to my good friend Jon from "down under". He made a extremely good point to me about our discussions.
What is needed, more than "skill education" or "realization education" is a business education. This is needed not just for installers but also inspectors. Heck, I am the
worse
handling what I earn. Anymore, I try not to know how much I "might have" because I like to buy toys.

The point is, some installers will bid, for example, $400.00 on a job that cost $500.00 to install!
Some inspectors will do an inspection for $100.00 ( guys, believe this, these are actual numbers for inspections) to $150.00 that they should be charging double to five
times that
amount. No one, with these attitudes, make profit on their work and sundries.

If this is a business then it should be managed like a business. That is the word we need, "manage". Stores have managers. Manufacturers have supervisors, managers,
Deparment
Heads and so on up the ladder. When have any of you heard an installer say, "this is my business and i am the manager" ??????
This is one of the lessons I have heard for years Mr. Hunt preach.

Jon, my good friend was right, he told me, before any type of training, the guys have to learn or be taught this is a business with expenses, cost overheard, retirement,
insurance
and on and on and on. Time must be factored into the work week to also "manage" the business.

Jon is a smart man.

12/24/2008
10:19:21 PM 

Roger,
give a "rough" estimate of your
inspection cost vs what the mills pay.

Does it meet all your requirements?

Once, I had a manager, who was
mad at me for the cost of a long trip,
and I had told him in advance, that
it was way too much and I had a
choice, cut the cost down to the cost
of a local inspection, or lose work,,,,I
did not change the invoice. I lost
work. He went livid on the phone
when I mention the expenses and
cost of doing biz like you did Roger,
one of his comments was, "We don't
pay those expenses",,,to which I
said, "I do" and just like your
company, I have to factor in those
costs. He hung up on me....Still
don't get a whole bunch from them,
who cares.
I had rather sit on my rear than lose
money to a billion dollar a year corp.

12/25/2008
3:57:02 PM 

So,
you have noticed a correlation between $25.00 to $50.00 difference. So, you have learned, volume will increase profit. The thing is, I know of a few inspectors with flat rates
in the Atlanta area, one in particular who the managers have expressed extreme displeasure but the analyst love who still gets all the work. His rate? $175.00. He works a large area.


So, do you have exact expenses or are you like me? I "estimate" my cost. My experience with the mills is similar. I can do work ranging from 100 to 250 miles from my home
for $150.00 or do nothing. I chose to do nothing. After a "hard time" some returned and some analyst did not. I crunched the numbers and found out, I was losing money
working on their terms.

This is my business, not theirs. I started setting "my terms". As I said, some left, some pee0ed managers and analyst made some nasty calls but, slowly they have returned. I
don't have the volume but profit is profit and the profit is down, but, no more giving charity to billion dollar corporations.

All of us are professionals. WE should be respected as such and our trades respected.

We must learn, how to run these trades as businesses, not charity for anyone, mills, distributors, retailers, and consumers.

12/27/2008
2:39:01 AM 

Don't hurt yourself Jon ..

12/27/2008
4:45:35 AM 

Hey you guys it's a lot easier to say something than to type it here. Be easy on me

12/28/2008
3:03:31 AM 

Roger has some good points. Things we don't think about enough
A bit about me that a lot of you don't know. I was involved with the Master Floor Covering Association of New Zealand for about 10 years. I also have a small interest with a flooring retailer so in a way I can look at things with three different hats.
I started laying vinyl for wages about 42 years ago. I changed over to contracting after 5 years with another layer when business was good. At that time everybody reckoned to end up with the same money in your hand, as on wages; however, we learned you had to earn at least double and maybe now treble these days. To do that, to cover the down time, holidays and most importantly the free company vehicle which I used to take home, I went from $34 a week on wages to $34 a day with most expenses supplied. All I had to supply was a vehicle, tools and me.
From there I changed over to laying for a retailer contracting where I had to supply everything except the vinyl, underlayment and bars. When you went to the pub after work you would hear all the guys from different trades saying "look what we made today" forgetting it was going to rain for the rest of the week and they would be watching the rain all week, meaning, no work, no money.




All that money I had in the bank the wife said was mine now belonged to everybody else. I had glue bills, petrol, household bills, taxes for every Government Department they could dream up, Goods and Services Taxes, Accident Compensation, and even Personal Tax.


I have a very good friend, who is a supplier. He tells me this is where the self employed contractors got into trouble. They were thinking of running free programs to help the installers learn how to manage their money. The supplier wanted the installers to be business people. The installers were very good at installing but not good at doing the paper work to pay the bills.


The installers are not the Business People. They should be even though that is why they dropped the wages to go contracting because they could see the money that the 'others' were charging. What happen? The suppliers were not getting paid for their materials because the layers had to pay the taxes etc. Why offer these free programs to the installers/layers? The suppliers wanted to get paid!. As everyone knows you don't pay the supplier you don't get anymore product. No product = No work. New Zealand is small and most suppliers know all the layers. Now, the installers went from being an employee for a retailer to self-employed. They were not equipped by training and experience to handle the money to cover costs and ensure a profit.



What installers should do is get their name out there. Be a business. Be friends with the suppliers, join flooring associations, get involved with message boards. Again! get your name out there. This is probably more important than ever before due to work being slow. The more people that know your name means that there are more people that can mention your name to get work That word of mouth works is low cost advertisement Approach your Work as a business.
I am "old" now and wished I had done these things but talking to you guys is like talking to the converted.
How do we get to the others?

12/28/2008
10:59:37 AM 

I can do that for you Jerry .

12/28/2008
5:31:35 PM 

Through the Flooring Assoc here you can get cheaper petrol, even though most buisiness's can do this, I think I get 3 cents a litre off, also I could get cheaper mobile phone calls , discounted health care insurance etc. The Assoc here is trying to get members to join and this type of thing is one way of giving the members something. The only trouble is that by the time it goes through the Assoc after 10 meetings because some di.....head suggests getting different prices from operisation companies most of the members have joined with another group. Been there Done that. My area did all the spade work with BP and took it to a executive meeting. Some other area said get a price from Shell Results 2 more executive meetings later everybody all ready had a discount card and didn't want to change. Bloody committies and their rules

12/29/2008
3:02:18 AM 

You just take your wallet in NJ , If there is $90.00 in it you passed .

12/29/2008
5:49:03 PM 

IN SC, all I do is pay the State LLC
Board $50.00, no test, nothing, to be a
hardwood or ceramic tile installer.....
nothing for any other type of flooring